I’m curious to know: Have you been let go from a job? Yes. Twice. Once fired, and deserved. Once due to financial constraints of the organization. For the latter, I was given a small severance but was also allowed to extend my time a little while doing my job search. It was humbling to ask for the extension, but it was granted and that felt very supportive.
Have you had to let other people go, either once in a while or en masse? Yes, both, for the same reasons as above.
What made it better or worse?
As far as letting people go for performance, I allowed less-than-stellar performers the option of resigning (vs firing).
For financial staff layoffs - we tried to spread the reductions across all functions; administrative, service, operations, etc.
Or is there simply no good way to do it? There ARE good ways to do it - you mentioned them. It is just that there is never an EASY way to do it.
I've been let go three times. The first hurt the most as it came out of the blue and I really felt betrayed. I had been there 11 years and got a new boss when we were reverse-acquired. I got moved out in a restructuring that saw my role combined with two others. It didn't work out.. They split the role back into three within a year. The second time was in the financial meltdown post Lehman Brothers. I was working in Europe and my firm sold off the European business. I came home unemployed. The third time was back just after having done an ex -pat stint for one arm of my company and uprooting my life for them, coming back to work for another business unit and getting packaged off from them within 8 months in another restructuring. That was a blessing- my boss was a nightmare and I hated it :)
I've managed people out more than I have fired, but have directly fired a couple for poor performance. They were both for cause so we were not generous- no package to speak of. It's no fun getting rid of someone no matter how crap they are though, particularly when you've been on the other side of the table. They're human beings with families and obligations and taking their pay check away weighs on you. Or at least it should!
I’ve had jobs in so many sectors that I can’t remember whether I was fired or walked away. Mostly, if I knew I was a bad fit, I walked away. Why waste their money and my time? If only I applied that to relationships!
I have been laid off twice from the aerospace industry, so my tale is not unique. Regarding the manner of layoffs, the second was the most memorable. A week before the layoffs began, our manager assured us that no one in our group would be laid off. When reminded of this comment later, she simply said, "I lied." Having access to a "back door" of the layoff data sheet, I learned that my name was exchanged with another's at least four times, before I was finally selected to go. When I was summoned to the manager's office, she did not know where she was supposed to sign the layoff form, so I had to point it out to her. As you can guess, she and I were at odds. So, when she asked me if I had anything to say to her, I replied, "Yes! Goodbye!"
There are two maxims I take from this discussion on firing/being fired well.
First: Keep business business. Do everything in your power to keep job performance, economics, and other work forces from becoming personal. Lay out the facts because you’ve done a fair assessment of the worker’s overall value to the company, where the balance sheet demands layoffs, etc.. If you’re on the fired side, you hope the one doing the firing is judicious and transparent like this. If you’re the one doing the firing, provide as many tangible reasons and feedback to your employee without resorting to platitudes.
Second: Treat humans humanly. Regardless of what side you fall on this (fired/the one doing the firing), conduct the process with compassion, grace, and a desire for the other person’s good. Sometimes you/ that person are not a good fit for your organization; it can be a good thing for both parties to end the relationship, but to do it glibly or without consideration for the fallout it creates is to treat people as commodities rather than people with dignity and value. This will be much more credible if you/they have been treated this way during the entire time of their employ rather than a last-ditch effort at civility.
In the mid-2000s, I worked for an engineering and design firm that was growing like wildfire. We opened offices, we added staff, we doubled our office space. The Portland-based company had 28 offices across the U.S., and was considering opening offices in Canada and Mexico.
Then 2008 happened. You'd leave the office at 5 and say good night to your co-worker. The next morning you'd return to see an empty desk where your buddy sat. Without a word or goodbye, she was gone. This happened day-after-day without anyone in management saying anything.
In the interim, the founder-CEO and company president were on a whirlwind tour of offices holding all-staff meeting to talk about the "enduring company" that was being built. We were told at the weekly all-staff meeting to expect the corporate leadership the next week. Three of our teammates had disappeared the night before. Someone asked the VP who headed our office, "How many of us won't be here when they come next week?"
The leadership came and made their groovy presentation about the company's brilliant future -- but nary a word about the fact that our office had dropped from 128 employees to 90 over the prior seven days.
It was the most tone-deaf example of corporate leadership I ever saw in my life. I wanted to write a case study about it. I was laid off in the last batch that year. It was the best thing that ever happened to me.
I have had to fire three people in my life, and let me tell you that two of them broke my heart. The third one was obviously not working, and she knew it. It wasn't a surprise. It was just time. We parted as friends.
But the other two were awful. Everyone knows it's no fun to get fired, but until I had to do it, I had no idea of how painful it is for the person doing the firing. You may think oh, boo hoo, who cares, but consider the reasons. The first one simply wasn't bringing in enough money after three years. We couldn't afford to keep him. Being let go was devastating to him and very hard to watch. I cried when he left. The second one occurred because the person was not showing up for work and not calling, and she kept screwing up. It was hurting the business. What made it especially painful was that I knew she was suffering from severe depression. That's why she was screwing up. And now she wouldn't be able to afford the therapy she needed. But I couldn't let things go on as they were and we aren't big enough to sustain someone who is so unreliable and making too many mistakes. She was a very good person and very smart. That one still haunts me. I wish I had done it better.
Here are my suggestion for how to fire someone:
Before you do it, see if it can be saved. Have a frank conversation and really listen. If they are very unhappy and you are very tactful, you might maneuver them into quitting when they realize how bad the situation truly is. But if there is no hope, do the following:
Be honest. Say how it has affected you and the business.
Be ready. Have a severance check ready and be professional.
Be kind. Let them talk it out. This may not be pleasant, but unless they have been seriously horrible, they deserve that much.
Offer to help, if appropriate. Make a few calls on their behalf if you can. Unless they were truly abhorrent, be generous if someone calls for a reference.
Do something nice for yourself after. Few people will understand what you have just been through, but if you know someone who will get it, call them.
Understand something my father said once. I had remarked that my boss at the time was a jerk, and he responded with all sincerity that all bosses are jerks. He included himself in that category; he was a boss. Being in charge of other people is not a natural position to be in. It's a structure that is essentially artificial, even though it's necessary. You are as human as the people who work for you, but you must be in charge. That is not an occasion to bully or order people around. It is a time to be responsible in a way that is organized, good for the business, and humane. If you can't do those things, don't be a boss.
I worked for a small company whose leader was very conscious of the social contract between the company and the employees. He and the HR group (aka the people people ;-) made significant effort on the hiring side to only bring in good-fit people when there was a long term need. Employees were NOT commodities. They were people. Having to let someone go was painful. My friend, who had started and at the time led the People People (aka HR) group said "I love my job. I would do it for no pay. Except for days when I have to let someone go. Those are the days they have to pay me for..."
It's amazing to think back on this and appreciate it even more in hindsight.
I've only ever been let go from my first job so far because of poor performance and cutting costs: a call center job, which I absolutely hated working, and worked at while underaged at the time.
Now at 20, I have a much more physically demanding but more fulfilling job, but am still on the search to improve my career path from there!
Yes I knew that I would very likely be laid off, but my boss didn’t hint at it when he flew over to see me. We had lunch and as I was pulling away in my company car he waved me down and asked for my company travel card and said to meet him in the morning for breakfast and have a ride home as he was taking the company car.
I worked for a tech firm in the 90’s. Middle management. Back then the company provided all kinds of “perks”. We had a “den” where there were kegs on tap and a kitchen. This was to get you to work longer hours and it worked. Problem was the firm expected more and more. Many were working 50-60 hours. When that stopped happening, or people never stepped up, they were let go. I had to let them go. There’s not a good way to do it. Especially when expectations went beyond the norm of 40 hours. I was happy to leave corporate America.
It is the worst part of being the “boss” at any level of employment . I am a Dairy Queen franchisee and I am dealing with very young women(mostly) and when I had finally decided that employment at the DQ was the wrong for a training employee, I always tried to impress the person, that the “job”, not the person, was the problem. I would always try to steer them to another job, where they would be more comfortable.
Their feelings were my most important consideration.
Bill, been let go twice - once second year out of school and it was a recession. Second time was a difference of philosophy with senior management. Like Jobs, it was one of the best things that happened to me and I went on to the last 15 years of my career in the same industry (commercial real estate), but at a series of positions with the same company that I always wanted to do. BTW, the first time I was let go was from an architecture firm (my major) and that is when I got into real estate!
Had to let several people go - performance, economy and HR issues. Not fun, but I think from above, you realize that many times it ends up being one of the best things that happens to you.
I took a job years ago knowing there was an end date between 2 and 3 years. When it came time for my layoff interview I had to console my boss. She was crying and I was telling her everything was going to be ok.
Go figure.
Everything was ok and I wound up in an industry that I didn’t know existed until I literally ran into my boss accidentally. Almost 19 years later I’m still loving what I do and have no regrets.
I’m curious to know: Have you been let go from a job? Yes. Twice. Once fired, and deserved. Once due to financial constraints of the organization. For the latter, I was given a small severance but was also allowed to extend my time a little while doing my job search. It was humbling to ask for the extension, but it was granted and that felt very supportive.
Have you had to let other people go, either once in a while or en masse? Yes, both, for the same reasons as above.
What made it better or worse?
As far as letting people go for performance, I allowed less-than-stellar performers the option of resigning (vs firing).
For financial staff layoffs - we tried to spread the reductions across all functions; administrative, service, operations, etc.
Or is there simply no good way to do it? There ARE good ways to do it - you mentioned them. It is just that there is never an EASY way to do it.
I've been let go three times. The first hurt the most as it came out of the blue and I really felt betrayed. I had been there 11 years and got a new boss when we were reverse-acquired. I got moved out in a restructuring that saw my role combined with two others. It didn't work out.. They split the role back into three within a year. The second time was in the financial meltdown post Lehman Brothers. I was working in Europe and my firm sold off the European business. I came home unemployed. The third time was back just after having done an ex -pat stint for one arm of my company and uprooting my life for them, coming back to work for another business unit and getting packaged off from them within 8 months in another restructuring. That was a blessing- my boss was a nightmare and I hated it :)
I've managed people out more than I have fired, but have directly fired a couple for poor performance. They were both for cause so we were not generous- no package to speak of. It's no fun getting rid of someone no matter how crap they are though, particularly when you've been on the other side of the table. They're human beings with families and obligations and taking their pay check away weighs on you. Or at least it should!
I’ve had jobs in so many sectors that I can’t remember whether I was fired or walked away. Mostly, if I knew I was a bad fit, I walked away. Why waste their money and my time? If only I applied that to relationships!
Fortunately, I’ve not been fired from a job in either my civilian or military jobs. I have let go of jobs due to personal choice.
On the other hand, I have had to let go of a contractor once. It was not easy to do but was necessary and supported by all in the organization.
I have been laid off twice from the aerospace industry, so my tale is not unique. Regarding the manner of layoffs, the second was the most memorable. A week before the layoffs began, our manager assured us that no one in our group would be laid off. When reminded of this comment later, she simply said, "I lied." Having access to a "back door" of the layoff data sheet, I learned that my name was exchanged with another's at least four times, before I was finally selected to go. When I was summoned to the manager's office, she did not know where she was supposed to sign the layoff form, so I had to point it out to her. As you can guess, she and I were at odds. So, when she asked me if I had anything to say to her, I replied, "Yes! Goodbye!"
There are two maxims I take from this discussion on firing/being fired well.
First: Keep business business. Do everything in your power to keep job performance, economics, and other work forces from becoming personal. Lay out the facts because you’ve done a fair assessment of the worker’s overall value to the company, where the balance sheet demands layoffs, etc.. If you’re on the fired side, you hope the one doing the firing is judicious and transparent like this. If you’re the one doing the firing, provide as many tangible reasons and feedback to your employee without resorting to platitudes.
Second: Treat humans humanly. Regardless of what side you fall on this (fired/the one doing the firing), conduct the process with compassion, grace, and a desire for the other person’s good. Sometimes you/ that person are not a good fit for your organization; it can be a good thing for both parties to end the relationship, but to do it glibly or without consideration for the fallout it creates is to treat people as commodities rather than people with dignity and value. This will be much more credible if you/they have been treated this way during the entire time of their employ rather than a last-ditch effort at civility.
In the mid-2000s, I worked for an engineering and design firm that was growing like wildfire. We opened offices, we added staff, we doubled our office space. The Portland-based company had 28 offices across the U.S., and was considering opening offices in Canada and Mexico.
Then 2008 happened. You'd leave the office at 5 and say good night to your co-worker. The next morning you'd return to see an empty desk where your buddy sat. Without a word or goodbye, she was gone. This happened day-after-day without anyone in management saying anything.
In the interim, the founder-CEO and company president were on a whirlwind tour of offices holding all-staff meeting to talk about the "enduring company" that was being built. We were told at the weekly all-staff meeting to expect the corporate leadership the next week. Three of our teammates had disappeared the night before. Someone asked the VP who headed our office, "How many of us won't be here when they come next week?"
The leadership came and made their groovy presentation about the company's brilliant future -- but nary a word about the fact that our office had dropped from 128 employees to 90 over the prior seven days.
It was the most tone-deaf example of corporate leadership I ever saw in my life. I wanted to write a case study about it. I was laid off in the last batch that year. It was the best thing that ever happened to me.
I have had to fire three people in my life, and let me tell you that two of them broke my heart. The third one was obviously not working, and she knew it. It wasn't a surprise. It was just time. We parted as friends.
But the other two were awful. Everyone knows it's no fun to get fired, but until I had to do it, I had no idea of how painful it is for the person doing the firing. You may think oh, boo hoo, who cares, but consider the reasons. The first one simply wasn't bringing in enough money after three years. We couldn't afford to keep him. Being let go was devastating to him and very hard to watch. I cried when he left. The second one occurred because the person was not showing up for work and not calling, and she kept screwing up. It was hurting the business. What made it especially painful was that I knew she was suffering from severe depression. That's why she was screwing up. And now she wouldn't be able to afford the therapy she needed. But I couldn't let things go on as they were and we aren't big enough to sustain someone who is so unreliable and making too many mistakes. She was a very good person and very smart. That one still haunts me. I wish I had done it better.
Here are my suggestion for how to fire someone:
Before you do it, see if it can be saved. Have a frank conversation and really listen. If they are very unhappy and you are very tactful, you might maneuver them into quitting when they realize how bad the situation truly is. But if there is no hope, do the following:
Be honest. Say how it has affected you and the business.
Be ready. Have a severance check ready and be professional.
Be kind. Let them talk it out. This may not be pleasant, but unless they have been seriously horrible, they deserve that much.
Offer to help, if appropriate. Make a few calls on their behalf if you can. Unless they were truly abhorrent, be generous if someone calls for a reference.
Do something nice for yourself after. Few people will understand what you have just been through, but if you know someone who will get it, call them.
Understand something my father said once. I had remarked that my boss at the time was a jerk, and he responded with all sincerity that all bosses are jerks. He included himself in that category; he was a boss. Being in charge of other people is not a natural position to be in. It's a structure that is essentially artificial, even though it's necessary. You are as human as the people who work for you, but you must be in charge. That is not an occasion to bully or order people around. It is a time to be responsible in a way that is organized, good for the business, and humane. If you can't do those things, don't be a boss.
5 stars Bill.
I worked for a small company whose leader was very conscious of the social contract between the company and the employees. He and the HR group (aka the people people ;-) made significant effort on the hiring side to only bring in good-fit people when there was a long term need. Employees were NOT commodities. They were people. Having to let someone go was painful. My friend, who had started and at the time led the People People (aka HR) group said "I love my job. I would do it for no pay. Except for days when I have to let someone go. Those are the days they have to pay me for..."
It's amazing to think back on this and appreciate it even more in hindsight.
I've only ever been let go from my first job so far because of poor performance and cutting costs: a call center job, which I absolutely hated working, and worked at while underaged at the time.
Now at 20, I have a much more physically demanding but more fulfilling job, but am still on the search to improve my career path from there!
Yes I knew that I would very likely be laid off, but my boss didn’t hint at it when he flew over to see me. We had lunch and as I was pulling away in my company car he waved me down and asked for my company travel card and said to meet him in the morning for breakfast and have a ride home as he was taking the company car.
Good times🥴
I worked for a tech firm in the 90’s. Middle management. Back then the company provided all kinds of “perks”. We had a “den” where there were kegs on tap and a kitchen. This was to get you to work longer hours and it worked. Problem was the firm expected more and more. Many were working 50-60 hours. When that stopped happening, or people never stepped up, they were let go. I had to let them go. There’s not a good way to do it. Especially when expectations went beyond the norm of 40 hours. I was happy to leave corporate America.
It is the worst part of being the “boss” at any level of employment . I am a Dairy Queen franchisee and I am dealing with very young women(mostly) and when I had finally decided that employment at the DQ was the wrong for a training employee, I always tried to impress the person, that the “job”, not the person, was the problem. I would always try to steer them to another job, where they would be more comfortable.
Their feelings were my most important consideration.
Bill, been let go twice - once second year out of school and it was a recession. Second time was a difference of philosophy with senior management. Like Jobs, it was one of the best things that happened to me and I went on to the last 15 years of my career in the same industry (commercial real estate), but at a series of positions with the same company that I always wanted to do. BTW, the first time I was let go was from an architecture firm (my major) and that is when I got into real estate!
Had to let several people go - performance, economy and HR issues. Not fun, but I think from above, you realize that many times it ends up being one of the best things that happens to you.
Thankfully I’ve never had to fire nor hire anyone and I’ve never lost a job.
I took a job years ago knowing there was an end date between 2 and 3 years. When it came time for my layoff interview I had to console my boss. She was crying and I was telling her everything was going to be ok.
Go figure.
Everything was ok and I wound up in an industry that I didn’t know existed until I literally ran into my boss accidentally. Almost 19 years later I’m still loving what I do and have no regrets.